Massive Online Gamer’s Jason Winter interview part 2

the new defunct Massive Online Gamer Magazine

As promised, today I bring you Part 2 of my interview with former Massive Online Gamer Editor in Chief Jason Winter. Enjoy!

KTG:  MOBAS like League of Legends have really come up this year. I noticed MOG was covering them more and more, even in this last issue you had an article detailing the Dominion map. Are you surprised at all, by the rise in popularity in these types of games? Do you think that they can coincide along the bigger titles like SWTOR and GW2??

JW: A: I think MOBAs are a natural evolutionary path of MMORPGs. And, in fact, we’ve probably all been playing something just like them for years but didn’t realize it. My classic “Rift is a pretty game to sit around waiting for dungeon queues to pop” line from a previous TWIMMO is a part of this
observation, but it applies to many MMORPGs. In my case, I’ve been playing The Lord of the Rings Online since April 2007. That’s 57 months. My main character has been at the level cap for 46 of those months. That’s about 80% of the time he’s existed. And what do you do at level cap? Mostly you form up groups for instances, raids, maybe PvP, etc. You don’t really run around the world doing quests like you did when you were leveling. Yes, you can do some socializing, and a little crafting and miscellaneous activities, but if you want to advance your character, the best way to do it, in most cases, is to form up a group and hit a dungeon.

What do you do in a MOBA? Queue up for “PvP instances,” basically. MOBAs are just PvP MMOs without the questing and (in some form) leveling. Take a look at Guild Wars, where you could make a max-level character just to do PvP right out of the gate. How’s that different from a MOBA? So many people rush to level cap these days to do endgame anyway, and there’s really no difference between doing that and just starting out in a MOBA. And that 46/57 months thing takes into account that I’m a notoriously slow leveler 🙂

Now, I’m hopeful that games like GW2 will, as ArenaNet claims, make the endgame the whole game, and that you’ll still be incentivised to run around the world and not just sit around cities queueing up for dungeons. As much as people say GW1 wasn’t a true MMORPG, it might be that most non-GW2 are more MOBA than MMORPG, which is kinda ironic.

KTG: What are you going to miss most, would you say, about working with the staff of Beckett’s Online Massive Gamer magazine??
JW: Ping pong. That is all.

KTG:  I was somewhat surprised to see that your editorial staff chose GW2 as the top mmo of 2012 and beyond, what gives GW2 an edge over other games in your opinion, considering that was a list which includes so many great games like “The Secret World” and “Everquest Next” just to name a few?

JW: We actually had a formula that took a few factors into consideration and GW2 had the best “numbers.” That’s the short answer. The somewhat-longer answer is like what I referred to earlier, that I think ArenaNet and GW2 “get” that people are looking for something different, and they’re not just going to deliver something different for the sake of being different – they’re doing it because it’s actually better, at least in theory. Funcom’s sort-of got that with The Secret World, too, doing away with leveling (which, as referred to above, is something you won’t be doing with your character 80% or more of the time anyway). Honestly, we just don’t know enough about EQNext to give it super-high marks, but the brand name itself was worth a few points.

KTG:  Since this blog (killthegoblinsavetheworld) is mostly about retro-mmo games, what mmo do you think fans would benefit from being resurrected or redone for a modern audience in your opinion and why?

JW: A: Retro games? You mean like Star Wars: Galaxies? 🙂
It’s only sorta retro, being just a few years old, but I thought Auto Assault was a great premise. As an old Car Wars fan, I loved the idea, but the problem was that NCSoft made it “too MMO-like.” Meaning that instead of making it a game about cars with guns, they made it an MMO, with DPS, healers, support, tanks, etc., but instead of people, you had cars. In other words, it was the same as anything else out there.

I’d like an MMO of vehicular combat that you could tweak and min/max to your heart’s content. Want more speed? You’ll have to shed some armor or weapons. Want bigger guns? OK, but you won’t be as fast. And so on. Come on, Steve Jackson, you know you want to do this!

KTG: Yea that would be great! I was a fan of the Car Wars pen and paper game too. OK so the big question on a lot of people’s minds, Wow: the king of them all, at least for now. What are your thought’s on Blizzard’s behemoth and its future and its impact in the mmo game industry? Do you think SWTOR can have lasting power to topple it from the mmo throne, or do you think it will fizzle out like many shiny new mmos before it?

JW: Something a lot of people have said, and that I agree with, is that “The only thing that will kill WoW is WoW.” A new game, whether it’s SWTOR or GW2 or TSW or EQN isn’t going to “kill” WoW, not directly at least. Like I said, gamers are looking for something more in their MMOs than… uh, well, “kill the goblins and save the world.” If newer games rewrite this paradigm and steal some players from WoW, that won’t be the real impact of their success. Rather, players will look at what those games are doing and think, “I like WoW, but why can’t it be more like this game?” If Blizzard can’t adjust its game to be more in line with these newer offerings, then who really “killed” WoW? Some other game for “stealing” WoW’s players or Blizzard for not changing WoW to meet the needs and wants of its players?

That’s it guys! I want to than Jason once again for taking the time out of his busy schedule to speak to me and hope to bring you more interviews from some of the big guns in the industry in the future. Pick up a copy of the Mar/April edition of Massive Online Magazine, it will be the last but it should still be out on stands now.

Former Editor of Massive Online Gamer interview

Jason Winter a regular at TWIMMO and Game Breaker.TV

Today I have a special treat for you guys!  Part One of an exclusive Q&A interview with Jason Winter. Some of you who tune into the TWIMMO show over at Gamebreaker.tv may be familiar with Jason’s work, as he is a regular on that website. Jason is also the former editor of Beckett Massive Online Gamer.

So sit back, chill and spend some time with us, as we get Jason’s take on many mmo related topics!

KTG: We were all pretty shocked to hear that the Mar/April edition of Massive Online gamer was gonna  be its last, were you surprised by Beckett’s decision to stop printing the magazine or were you prepared, did you see some sort of writing on the wall??

JW: It wasn’t that big of a shock. Without getting into too many details, I could tell from the numbers – magazine sales, subscriptions, and ad revenue – that we were not in the best of places, and I’d been making a few small inquiries about job opportunities elsewhere for a while. That it finally happened, and that it was as sudden as it was, did jolt me a little bit – after I got the news, I just went home for the rest of the afternoon – but I’m grateful that Beckett kept me on for as long as they did and I really do miss some of the people I worked with. Emphasis on “some.” 🙂

KTG: What were some of the highlights of working and editing MOG for the past six years, and conversely what were some of the low points, if any?? (NOTE: Jason Informed me he was not editor for the entire six year run of the magazine, as he became involved with the magazine in mid-2008 as a freelance writer. Then in Sept. 2009, he was promoted to Associate Editor and moved to the Beckett offices in Dallas in January 2010, becoming full Editor of the magazine in August of that year.)

JW: What I really loved the most about it had to be when we’d get props from our readers. It really meant something to have someone take the time out to let you know what they thought about your work, especially when it was something I worked on personally. If you like anything you read, whether it’s on a website, magazine, over Twitter or Facebook, take a moment to let the creator know how you feel, or even just chat or leave comments. He or she will really appreciate it, trust me. Oh, and I had a great time when Sony Online Entertainment  flew me (and other press) out to Vegas for Fan Faire this last year. Hey, I didn’t get that many perks, and that was a good one, even if I did totally flub the indoor skydiving.
As for the low points… well, let’s just say I do a little happy dance at 10:00 a.m. every Wednesday morning and leave it at that. A few people will get that.

KTG: What are some trends in the mmorpg industry over the span of editing and working in the magazine and website for the past few years that surprised, came out of left field maybe, or excited you about the future of the business?

JW: Even to just take the last 2-3 years into account, I’m surprised at how quickly players (and even I) have started to grouse about the “accepted” structure of an MMORPG: talk to a quest giver, get quest to kill/collect 10 whatevers, go back, rinse and repeat, quest up to max level, do endgame instances, and so on. Even more than the rise of F2P, I think this is what we’ll look back on as being the defining paradigm shift in the genre for years to come. We haven’t really had a big, shiny, mass-market game that breaks these conventions, not since WoW and its ilk hit the scene, but with games like Guild Wars 2 and The Secret World coming up, I think a lot of the “old guard” could be in for a shock. And if you’re developing a new MMO right now, you’d damn well better take that into account.

KTG: Maybe you have touched upon this in other places, but where do you stand on the whole f2p vs. p2p debate?

JW: It’s funny, but back when I first heard of the concept of an MMO, about 10 years ago, I thought it was stupid. “I have to buy a $50 game and then pay more to play it?” It was like if I bought Dungeons & Dragons books and then a representative from Wizards of the Coast came to my home every time I wanted to play and demanded a few bucks from me and my friends. It seemed to me that the money was in the subscriptions and continuing profits, not the box sales, so I thought MMO boxes should be very cheap – $15-$20 or so – or even free, and then you could charge up the hoozit for subscriptions.

OK, so I won’t say I saw all of this coming, but I thought it was the best model for the industry a while back. That said, there are, I think, three levels of F2P.  No. 1: “Everything in the cash shop is available in game (with reasonable effort – i.e., not taking 50 hours to grind for something I could buy for $3)”; No. 2: “Everything stat-related in the cash shop is available in game (some cosmetics, mounts, and other nonessentials are cash-shop-exclusive)”; and  No. 3: “Stat-related items that are better than what you can earn in-game are available only in the cash shop.”

I’m fine with #1 and #2. #3… not so much.

I get the notion of “It’s their game, they can run it however they want.” That’s true. And then it’s my right as a consumer to not play/but it. Obviously, enough people are OK with it that companies like Bigpoint can do business, and that’s fine. A new game that launches and wants to use system #3 is likely to meet with less criticism than a P2P game that switches to a #2 or #3 model. When you’re used to getting everything possible for your subscription fee, and that changes, it’s jarring, and we’re naturally predisposed to assume that the company is making the switch to increase its profits by squeezing more money out of its customers.

I spent a lot of time in the trading-card-game industry before coming to Beckett, and there are a lot of  similarities between TCGs and MMOs. In effect, TCGs are P2P PvP MMOs with cash shops – the more you spend (on things that can only be obtained by spending money), the better your chance of winning. Yes, a good player with less money can beat a bad player with more money, but if skill (and luck) is equal, a player with $1,000 worth of cards will beat a player with $100 worth of cards 99 times out of 100.

I got out of TCGs in part because I didn’t want to feel like the only way to get good was to spend more. That’s part of what drew me to MMOs, the fact that I could pay my $15 a month and be just as good as anyone, that money had been taken out of the equation. There aren’t that many TCGs any more, not nearly as many as there were 10-15 years ago, and part of the reason is because other people came to this same conclusion and didn’t want to feel like they had to invest their savings in a game to become proficient at it. I’m hopeful that MMOs don’t go along the same path.

And I know that a common argument is “Well, if you only PvE, what do you care if someone spends a bunch on the cash shop? It’s not affecting you.” Maybe, maybe not. If developers start gearing their toughest content to only be doable by people who have spent a bunch in the cash shop – likely because those who do spend money on exclusive items complain in the forums, etc. about the top-level content being “too easy” – then it becomes more difficult, or nigh impossible, for players without those exclusive items to complete it, those players lose interest, and the game suffers. It’s the old adage of 20% of the people making 80% of the noise, and developers need to make sure they’re not letting their “whales” dictate the direction of the game for everyone.

That is all for now guys, check back tomorrow for part 2 of our talk with Jason, and I want to thank Jason in advance for taking time out of his busy week to chat!

Top 5 gaming and geeky things of the year that was 2011

Thanks to MMO Gamer Chick, I was inspired to sneak this list in before the year goes into full swing. I know I am even later than she was in posting this, but it is still barely a week in, so here we go.

This is a crazy enough list, considering my system sucks and I never had either the motivation, time, or cash to upgrade my gaming gear. Thus, retro- mmo gaming was more a necessity for me, and you know that is the mother of innovation, or some nonsense. Okay on with the list.

The five geeky gaming things which brought joy to my heart in the year 2011:

Dark Age Of Camelot

The one and only game for PvP and the game which invented RvR was one of my hands down favorite retro-games of 2011, which is ironic given it was released back in 2001, though it is still immensely popular in some circles. Granted, players have long moved on to other mmorpgs, and even I acknowledge that there is a certain feeling of nostalgia associated with DAoC, more than a sense of a thriving community like one may find in newer games like say RIFT, or SWTOR. Nevertheless, there is still plenty of fun to be had in old Camelot, especially for those of us who discovered it for the first time recently. Mythic Entertainment’s  first attempt at an mmo is still their best IMHO, and is considered by many to be tops in pvp. For Midgard!!

Advanced Dungeons and Dragons 4E

 In 2011 I resolved to get back to the geeky table top game of my youth. While I never fully bought into the stereotype associated with the AD&D pen and paper game, my affinity for Turbine’s DDO mmo got me interested once more into D&D racial powers and finding out more about my Warforged character. This by extension led to my exploring the table top game once more. Wizards of the Coast has reinvented AD&D, and for better or worse, more people are finding their way back into table top gaming, with D&D back in the forefront of our imaginations. I traveled to my local game center in Pasadena a few times a year to take part in some campaigns, and with any luck, my table top gaming will be more consistent in 2012.

Felicia Day’s “Dragon Age Redemption” “The Guild” and “Pure Pwnage”

For me 2011 was the year of web programming. Network TV? Who has time for that now? With the exception of geek TV favorites “The Big Bang Theory” and watching sporting events, I hardly turn the damn thing on. I read an article stating that Americans now on average spend more time online than watching TV and I can believe it because that trend rings true in our household. It stands to reason then that my favorite programs are on the web, and most of the ones I like best are related to gaming somehow. From Gamebreaker TV, to most of the stuff on G4tv.com like the MMO Report, the internet is rich in web originals. My favorites are by Buffy alumn and internet star Felicia Day. Most web geeks will be familiar with Day’s web program “The Guild” and if you read my blog regularly, you know that I have been a fan from the beginning. This year, Felicia also starred in a web exclusive series based on Bioware’s Dragon Age series of games. Man was that a fantastic, albeit short series! Last but not least, I discovered this year the exploits of the Canadian show Pure Pwnage. At first glance, the show seems like a stereotyped strings of cliches about gamers, but the main character played by talented actor Jarrett Cale really sells it, you really get into the head of Jeremy, whose sole goal in life is to become “pro” and to pwn noobs. What’s not to love??

Beccket’s Massive Online Gamer- 

A long time ago I used to read PC Gamer magazine almost religiously, and still read it from time to time, but no other periodical topped Massive Online Gamer in coverage of my favorite gaming genre. Editor Jason Winter  and cohorts did a great job on a bimonthly schedule of bringing a plethora of mmorpg related news, more than any other publication on the stands. Sadly, I heard the upcoming Mar/April issue will be the magazine’s last, which is a real shame. I feel outside of the blogosphere, MOG had no parallel in terms of covering our favorite genre, albeit being a bit late on breaking stuff due to publication schedules and the nature of the web. A pity that it is fading from the scene because reportedly they did not have enough people reading it on a regular basis. I don’t know how I am going to replace it in 2012.

Youtube–

This may seem like an odd choice to include, but when I think about it, youbute, more than any other medium, kept me entertained and informed. It boasts of a vast, almost endless repository of gaming information right at our fingertips. Whether it was delighting in Boogie 2988’s funny transformations to Francis and other characters, looking for virtual guides on how to craft and travel in DAoC, or information on upcoming betas, Blizzcon, or community gripes, gamebreaker TV rants on wow patches and more, Youtube is a joy to peruse and a gamer’s endless source of fun and joy.

More M.O.B.A.S. like League of Legends to come our way in 2012?

I read an interesting article of predictions for gaming in mmorpg.com the other day about M.O.B.A.S.  If you are an avid gamer (and if you are not, why exactly are you reading this post?) you know that the proliferation of these types of games has seemingly skyrocketed lately, due largely in part to the satisfying “quick fix” which LOL and M.O.B.A. type games like DOTA provide players.

I think Youtube personality Boogie 2988 said it best when he alluded to the fact that former World of  Warcraft players and mmo enthusiasts may tire of the waiting in those types of games. As Boogie put it, Wow is a good game, but there is a lot of waiting around in that game, players have to queue for entrance into instances, whereas games like L.O.L. provide a lot of the instant gratification which some players have accustomed themselves to these days.

Coming from the mmo gaming side of things, I was quick to jump into the fray in League of Legends, which was very similar to Warcraft 3 (which it should be given that DOTA was a mod of Blizzard’s old RTS game) and I found the game lacking at first glance. For one thing, I missed the open world feel of a mmorpg game like Everquest 2 or World of Warcraft. Yes, combat is a significant part of gaming in those games too, but it is not the sole focus of the game. In L.O.L., you pick a champion and you go out and level him or her up, while your summoner also levels behind the scene.

It’s a more visceral, satisfying form of combat in some player’s point of view, but for old time mmo gamers like me (Though not as old to remember dabbling in original E.Q. or even Ultima Online) the game felt as though it did not offer as much diversity or richness of play as wow did, where you can do more than battle creeps and opposing teams (like crafting, questing, and raiding to name a few examples.)

Yet, the mmorpg.com article predicted a rise not only in M.O.B.A style gameplay (which seems accurate given Blizzard’s announcement during  this year’s Blizzcon about Blizzard DOTA’s impending release) but also, even more interesting, a rise in a hybrid type genre of game: an mmo like game mixing in elements of M.O.B.A.S.  Isn’t that what I was bemoaning was lacking in L.O.L. and surely my way of thinking is exactly what game devs foresaw. Crafty little devils!

There are many reasons I can see this prediction coming true: The rise in popularity of e-sporting events like those made prevalent by StarCraft and now L.O.L., the aforementioned dislike for waiting to be queued into instances in other games, not to mention the copy cat way in which game companies have a tendency to churn out copies of more successful or more high profile versions of other products.

Consider this further evidence: The online gaming communities have catered to just about every type of game genre there is, with a recent replication of sites devoted to L.O.L. specifically and M.O.B.A.S. in general. The aforementioned MMORPG.com blog has expanded and now has sister/partner sites dedicated to RTS gaming (rtsguru.com) and FPS gaming (fpsguru.com) could DOTAguru sites be far behind???

Lastly, my favorite game magazine, Massive Online Gamer dedicated not one, but two articles about M.O.B.A.S. this past issue, one detailing the rise of the Dominion map in L.O.L. and Another entitled “3 simple rules for L.O.L. beginners,” penned by Minnesota Vikings punter Chris Kluwe. In addition to being a major NFL athlete, Kluwe is a confessed gaming aficionado and he has a quirky and fun writing style, and if you have never read any of his articles, you owe it to yourself to read some of his work. You will be glad you did if you are a gamer.

Anyhoo, you might play devil’s advocate and say, “Hybrid M.M.O, M.O.B.A.S., don’t we have that already in a game like World of Warcraft?” and in a sense you would be correct, given that wow has b.g.s that are as much fun as L.O.L. Yet, it depends on your gaming style, M.O.B.A.s usually are more focused on team oriented objectives, not just ganking, though there is a bit of that too. I personally am in favor  of mixing the visceral thrills of L.O.L. with the more open ended and massive feel of an mmorpg like wow or DAoC. Just please don’t make it so unfriendly to newbs!

Oh and while I am at it, I leave you with this tantalizing tasty morsel of news….

Can noobs survive in the world of retro mmos?

battling mobs in Dark Age of Camelot is more fun in a group

“The legendary learning curves of yesterday’s MMOs have been severely smoothed in the post-World of Warcraft era….”

So begins an intriguing article by Sean Kavanagh on a new player’s perspective while playing an older mmo detailed in the September/October edition of Beckett’s Massive Online Gamer magazine. I’m not going to spoil the article for you guys, but suffice it to say that Kavanagh’s premise that gamers can actually enjoy a classic mmo experience (in his case adventuring through 1999’s Asheron’s Call) is a valid one.

I found this article interesting because I have come to the same conclusion playing Dark Age of Camelot, a game which along with Ultima Online and Everquest, is probably as classic in the mmo genre as you’re likely to get without going as far back as the graphical MUD days in which some of the conventions now associated with the genre were not yet invented.

The interesting thing is that I myself rolled a toon in AC not too long ago, only in my case it wasn’t a low population that turned me off the game, but I just could not get used to the graphics. As Kavanagh points out in his piece, a game like Asheron’s Call is no match visually for a modern mmo theme park like RIFT, but if you can get past the limitations of playing in a world whose graphic engine hasn’t been updated for several years, you can get some excitement out of the unique features the game has to offer. I experienced one of those features right off the bat on my first night adventuring through the game’s open ended world.

I was befriended by a long time player who agreed to be my patron and I bound allegiance to his character. This was a cool thing, but I must admit to having been perplexed by the myriad of buffs, spells and gear I was given in order to advance my noobish character. Even with the extra help, I just could not stomach those ancient graphics, Dark Age of Camelot has been an entirely different story.

That is not to say that there aren’t some things which newer MMOs have taken from a game like AC and improved upon. The interface isn’t as polished, for example, and it is true that the learning curve for this game is higher than other games, but someone willing to put in the time can get much enjoyment out of it. Turbine still updates the game and  continues to manage it along with its newer properties like Dungeons and Dragons Online.

now where have we seen this before??

As far as DAoC is concerned, playing it has left me astounded in regards to how many of the conventions now taken for granted by players in a game like wow were present in this game: flying from zone to zone, trading items between characters, etc. etc. I like DAoC’s combat mechanics better than wow’s myself, with the familiar D&D phrasing (“You hit the rat for 10 points of damage”) refreshingly intact.

I can’t really say if some of these conventions were in place in DAoC prior to their adoption by modern games like wow because I wasn’t playing DAoC back in the day and warcraft was one of the first truly modern mmos I tried, so maybe some of you mmo veterans can help me out. I know DAoC predates wow by at least 3 years, but there have been expansions along the way. It’s really a question of the chicken and the egg: which game adopted which convention from which.

No matter, if you feel like trying an old mmo like Asheron’s Call or DAoC I say more power to you, you will find there are those along the way who are willing to help. The games may have seen more popular days, but it’s refreshing to see players come back to them and it’s good to have them around as alternatives to the more modern games.